Comments (11)

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ShereifAce - 2022-08-20 22:09:11 UTC

lol.. "This should not be affected by coins the wealthy player makes through their own shops or from being paid"
you know the reason you're making money from shops is that i chose to not undercut you? xD i can easily sell everything you're selling at cheaper prices but I saw you made shops and chose to not undercut you for now xD

Also can easily beat that system if i sent bunny 10k and she sent it back.

Your suggestion sounds like you're trying to create a rule to target the ones above you in coinstop while reward you, it'd be exactly the same if i did a suggestion like:
what about each player in top 3 pays 1 million coins to admin shop? see? it'd be unfair when i make a suggestion that would favor me and punish you xD

Last update: 2022-08-20 22:14:45 UTC

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Duhbetter - 2022-08-20 23:07:22 UTC

Hmmm. Your reply implies you know my thoughts, and that you think my motives are ill intentioned.

"Your suggestion sounds like you're trying to create a rule to target the ones above you in coinstop while reward you, it'd be exactly the same if i did a suggestion like:
what about each player in top 3 pays 1 million coins to admin shop? see? it'd be unfair when i make a suggestion that would favor me and punish you xD"

You are currently the only one above me in coinstop. But since my coins would put me in the same situation as you, I would also have nerfed ability to sell to admin shops. I would be affected as much as you.

• Please explain how either of these rules would benefit me and hurt you, as you are the only one above me in the coinstop.
  
• Please explain how this wouldn't affect the others who also have over 1 million coins.
  

As for using pay to launder coins by sending and getting it sent back. Nice catch and an obvious flaw that I didn't think of, so income from pay should be excluded from my suggestion.

As for you undercutting all my shops: The prices for most items are already lower than they were when I started a few months ago and seem to keep going down. In general, I have priced my shops to be the same as other shops and have only dropped my prices when others have dropped their prices. I'm not trying to put anyone out of business; I'm trying to encourage the economy.

If you choose to undercut everything, then you would hurt mine and everyone else's shops and lower income for all including yourself. Not sure how undercutting everyone would help anything. And I'm not sure why you would want to.

Finally, I'm not trying to be number one in coinstop. I did what I could to increase my coins so I could spend as needed. And if I end up on page 2 one day, as long as I have the coins to get what I need, then I'm good.

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ShereifAce - 2022-08-20 23:17:32 UTC

You're the only player above 1 million coin who focuses heavily on making shops, we were joking the other day that this is your thing, you called yourself MCG's Walmart. (which is only true cuz i'm not trying to compete with you in that)
then you wanted to kinda punish all who're above 1 million except the ones making money from selling in players shops xD

I wont undercut you, i'm not even focused on sabotaging others or raising my coins right now, im focused on making events that increase the SMP's activity and engagement while being fun for everyone. i'm even spending money on it, i bought for over 30,000 coins stuff while building even tho i have these stuff i bought. saving time for me not to go home while encouraging others who're selling
Then i'll also be giving a big money reward.

So if you want to encourage economy maybe do something like that?
use your money to do that instead of doing a suggestion that punishes the grinders lol

the goal isn't to have everyone having the exact amount of money the goal is to keep economy rolling, market, sales, grinding,..etc

Reminder: First day of me back i sent you 100k coins for free just so you'd spend on /shops to increase economy

Last update: 2022-08-20 23:20:12 UTC

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Duhbetter - 2022-08-20 23:56:30 UTC

"You're the only player above 1 million coin who focuses heavily on making shops"
Actually, McGamerEllie has a lot of shops as well. My suggestion is meant to encourage people to make shops. I thought this was the goal of the economy, and would make the admin shops primarily for those just starting out. I have a lot of shops that do not sell much and I have to renew my shops regularly because of no activity. A number of my shops are there just because someone needed something so I created it to help them out. Most of the money I have made from shops is for more obscure items that are higher value and require a lot of grinding. Again, I'm not trying to benefit myself, but make things better for the server.

"i bought for over 30,000 coins stuff while building even tho i have these stuff i bought. saving time for me not to go home while encouraging others who're selling"
You are making assumptions about my actions that are not correct. I have easily spent over 200k since joining the server. I have also paid people to do projects for me. And I have given away so many resources to people, particularly to those just starting out.

I agree with getting more engagement with everyone on the server. Have you been to the Zoo? Most of the resources for the Zoo came from me, but it was a team effort to build and got a lot of engagement from the smp. I collected most of the resources for the Zoo instead of buying them because at the time I didn't have the coins to buy it all. I also just spent 10k plus just for logs for a personal project (my new storage room). I have also spent countless hours teaching people about claims, trusts, enderleads, etc, and even more time explaining to people how to use the shops (and will be my second book when I get time to compile my notes on it). I have another project in works called "The Achievement Zone". I already have the land claimed, just other things took focus lately.

"use your money to do that instead of doing a suggestion that punishes the grinders lol"
I'm a grinder. How do you think I have gotten the resources for my builds and shops? And how do the suggestions punish grinders? It rewards them if they are not on the top of the coinstop list, and encourages us who are to spend our coins. Not sure how this punishes anyone...

"the goal isn't to have everyone having the exact amount of money the goal is to keep economy rolling, market, sales, grinding,..etc"
I also agree that everyone shouldn't have the same amount of coins. But the suggestions were proposed to prevent us at the top of coinstop from abusing the admin shops and to contribute to the economy.

As for that 100k, I have given away more than that in resources and have spent more than that, and I started prior to you giving me that 100k. I spent money even when I didn't have a lot. Again, you are assuming things about me.

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ShereifAce - 2022-08-21 00:14:29 UTC

well.. lets keep the assumptions out
no ill intentions, that could only hurt not help
I know you're a good guy and smart player. you existing is helping the server
Your time and effort makes the server a better place.

However i disagree with the suggestion that richer players should be paying forced charity
i already pay a lot of charity all the time but i can imagine that stopping if im forced to do it instead of doing it out of a good intention

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Duhbetter - 2022-08-21 00:47:10 UTC

Ok, so the required spending can be removed from the suggestion.

What about the nerfed admin shops for players over a certain amount of coins? That allows players with less coins to gain coins, but limits those with coins from abusing the system. Thoughts on that?

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ShereifAce - 2022-08-21 01:00:59 UTC

i still dont agree with that also
but for example i can agree that the things on admin shop can be changed to be something thats not worth for a rich player while worth for a less rich player
for example if its something that cant be farmed a lot easier if you're fully geared, equally farmed by all players. and is cheap in price so it'd not make 100ks or millions if farmed for enough time.
then that wont be worth for someone with over a million cuz it will barely be a fraction in his coins so he'd spend his time on something else.
while the ones who have no coins or like less than 100k for example (top 9 pages in coinstop) will be able to see a difference in their coins if they grind

there should never be a way to make it so that if 2 players grind equally they wont get equally rewarded
but there can be ways to make the time not worth to spend on grinding for the ones on top

maybe give them something to spend time at that require time (while being fun or engaging)
got to be rewarding than punishing the ones who grinded
so if you grind enough to certain amount of coins. you'd be eligible to something rewarding that would need grinding in there instead of in coins.
then they pause on coin grinding while others grind coins to reach that new phase as well

Last update: 2022-08-21 01:01:49 UTC

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KaiNoMood - 2022-08-22 14:17:49 UTC

Although it could be done, I don't think I will put limits based on the Top Coins leaderboards.

Now, my personal thought is that too many players are giving too much importance to the Top Coins leaderboard.

I think players should also take into consideration other statistics, for example the ones in "/shop stats".

The reasons for the admin shops are mainly two:

• Give a way for players to get coins
  
• Influence the market prices (especially to combat making items too cheap)
  

The only limit I thought about adding and that might be added eventually is a daily limit of items that each player can sell to each admin shop. I know that a lot of players are enjoying grinding and selling as much as they can to the admin shops, but I see that most of them only focus on one particular item (usually exploiting it) instead of selling a bit of everything. I personally think it would be much more challenging if everyone was involved in grinding different items every day instead of grinding the same item every day. This way, I would also consider adding more items. And if some of you are thinking of using multiple accounts to "bypass" the limits, I'd like to remind everyone that one of the server rules is "No stats boosting" and might get your stats/coins reset or get banned.

Last update: 2022-08-22 14:18:02 UTC

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Duhbetter - 2022-11-03 16:28:39 UTC

Maybe just remove/disable the "/coinstop" command. If there isn't a Top Coins leaderboard, then people can't [easily] put importance in it.

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KaiNoMood - 2023-05-25 21:47:00 UTC

At the end of the day, there are a lot of players that love "/coinstop" and I can't just remove it. The ones who hate it do it because they can't "win" against those who are the richest. Money makes money, irl too. But there's actually one thing I can do about it. Most people hate this word: taxes. That makes the wealthiest have to work harder to keep their wealth.

A progressive taxation system could be implemented:

• People get taxed weekly
  
• It is based on the average amount of coins for the past week
  

I'd set it up like this:

• Up to 1m coins, 1% tax
  
• Between 1m and 5m coins, 2.4% tax
  
• Over 5m 5% tax
  
• Additional rule: all those below 50k coins do not pay any weekly tax
  

Example: if my average coins for the week are 3m coins, I'd pay 1% tax on 1m, and 2.4% tax on 3m, for a total of 58k coins to pay in taxes for that week.

Hopefully, this would also make people attempt to spend their coins instead of having them in their accounts forever.

Another idea I have is to have /coinstop to first show the 10 players that "spent" the most money, then the current leaderboard of richest players.

Last update: 2023-05-25 21:51:03 UTC

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-Robowling - 2023-05-25 22:55:05 UTC

You could also tax people based on how large there claims are and how many claims they have but this is just a thought.

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